QA：苏美尔文明和中国夏朝哪个更古老？AS：这是不恰当的比较，应该说中华文明和苏美尔文明哪个更古老
Which is older: the Sumer civilization or the Xia Dynasty of China?
译文简介
AS：这是两个不恰当的比较。夏朝：是一个有核心君主的统一国家。苏美尔文明：是诞生于美索不达米亚的一系列民族和城市文明的统称，他的时间线很长......
正文翻译
Profile photo for Aya Shawn
Aya Shawn
master in Computer Science, National University of Singapore
These are two inappropriate comparisons.
xia Dynasty: It was a unified country with a core monarch.
Sumerian Civilization: It is a collective name for a series of national and urban civilizations born in the Mesopotamia. The timeline is very long.
这是两个不恰当的比较。
夏朝：是一个有核心君主的统一国家。
苏美尔文明：是诞生于美索不达米亚的一系列民族和城市文明的统称，他的时间线很长。
The two cannot be compared.
Correct comparison:
Which is older, the Chinese civilization or the Sumerian civilization?
Or:
Which is older, the Akkadian Empire or the xia Dynasty;
两者不能相提并论。
正确比较：
中华文明和苏美尔文明哪个更古老？
或者：
阿卡德帝国和夏朝哪个更古老？
Correct comparison:
Which is older, the Chinese civilization or the Sumerian civilization?
Or:
Which is older, the Akkadian Empire or the xia Dynasty;
两者不能相提并论。
正确比较：
中华文明和苏美尔文明哪个更古老？
或者：
阿卡德帝国和夏朝哪个更古老？
Here is a simple comparison:
1. Which is older, the Chinese civilization or the Sumerian civilization?
The earliest urban ruins discovered in the Sumerian civilization area are the ruins of Ur. About 7000-4500 years ago.
The earliest urban ruins of Chinese civilization were discovered in Jiangxi Province, today's China. It is called the Chengtoushan Ancient City Ruins, which dates back to about 6500-4800 years ago.
Taking the establishment of cities as a symbol, the Sumerian civilization was a little earlier. Considering the errors in archaeological science's judgment of ancient times, it can basically be regarded as a civilization that developed in the same era.
这是一个简单的比较：
1.中华文明和苏美尔文明哪个更古老？
苏美尔文明地区发现的最早的城市遗址是乌尔遗址。距今约7000-4500年。
中华文明最早的城市遗址是在今天的中国江西省发现的。城头山古城遗址，距今约6500-4800年。
如果文明以城市的建立为标志，苏美尔文明要早一些。考虑到考古学对古代时间的判断错误，两者基本上可以认为是同一时代发展起来的文明。
1. Which is older, the Chinese civilization or the Sumerian civilization?
The earliest urban ruins discovered in the Sumerian civilization area are the ruins of Ur. About 7000-4500 years ago.
The earliest urban ruins of Chinese civilization were discovered in Jiangxi Province, today's China. It is called the Chengtoushan Ancient City Ruins, which dates back to about 6500-4800 years ago.
Taking the establishment of cities as a symbol, the Sumerian civilization was a little earlier. Considering the errors in archaeological science's judgment of ancient times, it can basically be regarded as a civilization that developed in the same era.
这是一个简单的比较：
1.中华文明和苏美尔文明哪个更古老？
苏美尔文明地区发现的最早的城市遗址是乌尔遗址。距今约7000-4500年。
中华文明最早的城市遗址是在今天的中国江西省发现的。城头山古城遗址，距今约6500-4800年。
如果文明以城市的建立为标志，苏美尔文明要早一些。考虑到考古学对古代时间的判断错误，两者基本上可以认为是同一时代发展起来的文明。
2. Which is older, the xia Dynasty or the Akkadian Empire?
The xia Dynasty was the first dynasty in Chinese civilization with clear historical records, royal identity records and archaeological discoveries. According to ancient Chinese historical records, the xia Dynasty existed from 2070 BC to 1600 BC.
The Akkadian Empire was the first unified state in Mesopotamia, ending the region's previous state of tribes and city-states. According to discovered historical records, the Akkadian Empire was founded from 2334 BC to 2192 BC.
Therefore, judging from the time of its establishment, the Akkadian Empire is older than the xia Dynasty.
2.夏朝和阿卡德帝国哪个更古老？
夏朝是中华文明中第一个有明确历史记载、王室身份记录和考古发现的王朝。据中国古代史料记载，夏朝存在于公元前2070年至公元前1600年。
阿卡德帝国是美索不达米亚第一个统一国家，结束了该地区以前的部落和城邦国家。根据已发现的历史记录，阿卡德帝国成立于公元前2334年至公元前2192年。
因此，从建立时间来看，阿卡德帝国比夏朝还要古老。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
The xia Dynasty was the first dynasty in Chinese civilization with clear historical records, royal identity records and archaeological discoveries. According to ancient Chinese historical records, the xia Dynasty existed from 2070 BC to 1600 BC.
The Akkadian Empire was the first unified state in Mesopotamia, ending the region's previous state of tribes and city-states. According to discovered historical records, the Akkadian Empire was founded from 2334 BC to 2192 BC.
Therefore, judging from the time of its establishment, the Akkadian Empire is older than the xia Dynasty.
2.夏朝和阿卡德帝国哪个更古老？
夏朝是中华文明中第一个有明确历史记载、王室身份记录和考古发现的王朝。据中国古代史料记载，夏朝存在于公元前2070年至公元前1600年。
阿卡德帝国是美索不达米亚第一个统一国家，结束了该地区以前的部落和城邦国家。根据已发现的历史记录，阿卡德帝国成立于公元前2334年至公元前2192年。
因此，从建立时间来看，阿卡德帝国比夏朝还要古老。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
评论翻译
很赞 ( 23 )
收藏
Srash
· Oct 31
The Akkadian and Assyrian empires fascinate me. They could carve out an empire in a world where the only civilisations were just basically them, with the next major one is ancient Egypt which was far away for that age.
阿卡德帝国和亚述帝国让我着迷。他们可以在一个世界上建立一个帝国，那里唯一的文明基本上就是他们，下一个主要文明是古埃及，对于那个时代来说，它距离很远。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
Gareth Wells
· Oct 31
Yes, that we currently know of. Human civilization may have been reset further back in time repeatedly.
是的，我们目前知道。人类文明可能已经多次被重置。
Graham White
· Nov 1
Unfortunately there’s little to no credible evidence of this idea that there were greater human civilizations before the ones discussed in this answer and this comment.
不幸的是，几乎没有任何可信的证据证明这个想法，即在这个答案和这个评论中讨论的文明之前存在着更伟大的人类文明。
Gareth Wells
· Nov 2
Well, as long as you keep such an open mind about it.
I note your qualification of “greater civilizations”. That's a cute touch.
There's tantalising emerging evidence of organised civilizations prior to those listed by the OP. Whether they were greater or not is subject to interpretation.
Others have listed them in these comments.
好吧，只要你对此保持开放的态度。
我注意到你对“更伟大文明”的描述。这是一种可爱的感觉。
在答主列出的文明之前，有一些诱人的新证据表明有组织的文明存在。它们是否更大还有待解释。
其他人已在这些评论中列出了它们。
Graham White
· Nov 2
But where’s the actual evidence for any of it? I included “greater” so you wouldn’t surmise, like all the other Hancock non-academic groupies, that Gobekli Tepe is evidence of some great ancient civilization, when there is no evidence it is.
但这些的实际证据在哪里呢？我添加了“更大”这个词，这样你就不会像所有其他汉考克的簇拥者一样猜测哥贝克力石阵是某个伟大古代文明的证据，尽管根本没有证据表明它确实如此。
Gareth Wells
· Nov 3
Like I said, new sites could be unearthed showing much older civilizations. Latest news:
“The first radiocarbon dating of the site indicates that initial construction began sometime in the last glacial period, more than 16,000 years before the present and possibly as far back as 27,000 years ago.
To put that in perspective, Göbekli Tepe, which is a massive stone assembly in present-day Turkey, is currently considered to be the oldest known megalith in the world. It dates to 11,000 years ago.”
就像我说的，新的遗址可能会被发现，显示出更古老的文明。最新消息：
“对该地点的首次放射性碳14测年表明，最初的建设始于末次冰期的某个时间，比现在早16,000多年，可能早至27,000年前。
客观地说，哥贝克力石阵是位于当今土耳其的一个巨大石块组合，目前正在考虑成为世界上已知最古老的巨石。它的历史可以追溯到11,000年前。”
Brian Wilson
· Nov 1
Yeah thats what everyone thought and still think that only “we” are the civilized people, the “others” that we traded with are just “babarians” :) how convenient right. Like now there is the “first world” and there is “thrid countries”
是的，这就是每个人的想法，并且仍然认为只有“我们”才是文明人，与我们交易的“其他人”只是“野蛮人”:)这多么方便啊。就像现在有“第一世界国家”和“第三世界国家”
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
Gary Sucher
· Nov 2
I didn’t realize that we are Assyrians. Well, some of us are.
我没有意识到我们是亚述人。嗯，我们中的一些人是。
Wei Shi
· Nov 1
That was the history of China until 3000 years ago.
这就是中国3000年前的历史。
Paolo Carpi
· Nov 2
Can you elaborate?
你能详细说明一下吗？
Wei Shi
· Nov 2
Chinese carve out an empire in a world where the only civilisations were just basically them, with the next major one is ancient Hindu which was 3000 miles snowy mountain path.
中国人在世界上建立了第一个帝国，当时唯一的文明基本上就是他们，下一个主要文明是古印度，那是在3000英里的雪山之外。
Gilles Ries
· Nov 1
Very wise and balanced answer.
Note however, for very old items, with a first city or organization (it remains fuzzy), at Gobekli Tepe that is a 10000 years old.
And as early organized empire, there is Egypt 5150 years ago (unification of north and south Egypt in 3150 BC).
非常明智和平衡的答案。
但请注意，对于非常古老的文明来说，把第一个城市或组织作为标准（依然是模糊的），哥贝克力石阵已有10000年的历史。
而作为早期有组织的帝国，有5150年前的埃及（公元前3150年南北埃及统一）。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
Graham White
· Nov 2
There’s no evidence that Gobekli Tepe is an organized city or civilization
没有证据表明哥贝克力石阵是一个有组织的城市或文明
Gilles Ries
· Nov 2
Hence my wording maybe not good: “city or organization”: if not a city, it is something organized. The first hypothesis proposed when discovering Gobekli Tempe was about a kind nomadic gathering, that occurred periodically. The construction of the site, the carving of the stones are not a single-day…
因此我的措辞可能不太好：“城市或组织”：如果不是城市，那就是有组织的。
在发现哥贝克力神庙时提出的第一个假设是关于一种定期发生的游牧聚会。场地的建设、石头的雕刻都不是一朝一夕的工作，肯定需要一个重要的组织。
随着越来越多的房屋痕迹被发现，最近的假设表明存在一座城市。
那么，事实上，对于最初的问题，人们可能会争论文明的定义是什么，以及从什么阶段开始，一个人类群体可以被称为文明。
哥贝克力石阵的照片：在我看来，相当漂亮的雕刻或雕塑。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
Zalán Tóth
· Nov 3
Isn’t Göbekli Tepe 12000 years old?
哥贝克力石阵不是有12000年历史了吗？
Terri Ferrari
· Nov 7
There is also the Harappan civilisation in the Indus Valley from about 5,300 years ago.
印度河流域还有大约5300年前的哈拉帕文明。
Ada Bush
· Nov 1
One thing that is good news for history enthusiasts is that China has discovered a new archaeological site, which is even older than the "夏" era and has clear text that says "尧"
对于历史爱好者来说，有一件好消息是，中国发现了一个新的考古遗址，它的历史甚至比“夏”还要古老。那个时代，发现了清晰的文字写着“尧”。
Tim Tran
· Nov 10
Is there a lix for this? I would love to read about it.
有这个链接吗？我很想读一下。
Tristan Sitko
· Nov 2
It is very intriguing that those two civilizations developed only centuries apart. Homo sapiens have been around for hundreds of thousands of years. What prompted urban development and civilization to happen at two very distant places during such a close timefrx?
非常有趣的是，这两个文明的发展仅相隔几个世纪。智人已经存在了数十万年。是什么促使城市发展和文明在如此接近的时间范围内发生在两个相距遥远的地方？
Dixit
· Nov 1
Since there's no contemporary evidence that the xia dynasty existed, I'd say this answer is rather redundant.
由于没有当代证据表明夏朝存在，我认为这个答案相当多余。
Peter Hsieh
· Nov 1
Until today, the British history books still teaching that King Arthur and his Round table still exist but it was pure Myth. Even Historians cannot give a actual date because it varies between 600Ad to 1200AD. At least xia Dynasty (from2070BC) have more solid documentary proof than King Arthur.
As for xia Dynasty, the latest Archaeologist have discovered Chinese Writings around 4500BC in China from the broken potteries unearthed recently. So, xia Dynasty existence will never be in doubt. At the same time, the discovery of SHIMAO in north China, a massive Castles, Palaces & Solid Stone Fortress over 15 meter in height (just like a massive pyramid) from 2300BC recently and the archaeology works will take at least many many decades to complete.
直到今天，英国历史书仍然教导亚瑟王和他的圆桌会议仍然存在，但这纯粹是神话。即使历史学家也无法给出一个实际的日期，因为它在公元600年到公元 1200年之间变化。至少夏朝（公元前2070年）比亚瑟王有更可靠的文献证据。
至于夏朝，最新的考古学家从最近出土的破碎陶器中发现了公元前4500年左右的中国文字。所以，夏朝的存在是不容置疑的。与此同时，在中国北方发现了一座巨大的城堡、宫殿和宫殿。这座坚固的石头堡垒高度超过15米（就像一座巨大的金字塔），建于公元前2300年，考古工作至少需要几十年才能完成。
Paolo Carpi
· Nov 2
Do the Chinese fool fanatics ever stop to blindly fight back against westerners? Everyone knows King Arthur is a elaboration of more ancient legend and no one think Arthur figure existed in the form it is represented in the lore.
Which western source you’ve read about King Arthur? The Disney’s movie?
中国的傻瓜狂热分子会停止盲目反击西方人吗？每个人都知道亚瑟王是更古老的传说的详细阐述，但没有人认为亚瑟王的形象以传说中所代表的形式存在。
您读过哪些有关亚瑟王的西方资料？迪士尼的电影？
Heaven Suny
· Nov 8
No If the West had not colonized, who would know whether David was a cat or a dog.
不如果西方没有殖民，谁知道大卫是猫还是狗。
Gary Sucher
· Nov 2
Your range is wrong on mythical Arthur. It would be between around 450 - 600 AD. After the Romans abandoned Britain during the Saxon conquests. Either way WAY before William the Conquerer.
你对神话中的亚瑟的射程是错误的。大约在公元 450 - 600 年之间。罗马人在撒克逊人的征服过程中放弃了英国。不管怎样，在征服者威廉之前。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
Heaven Suny
· Nov 8
It’s so funny to use mythology as history! If you look at it this way, South Korea is the earliest civilized country in the world.
把神话当作历史，太搞笑了！如果这样看的话，韩国是世界上最早文明的国家。
Sourish Pradhan
·
The xia dynasty is a bogus make-believe joke Chinese mythical state. The erlitiou culture merely dates to the early Shang period. It has no connection to xia despite Chinese efforts to forcibly lix it. Sumer was an actual civilization that is archeologically proven. It was the cradle of all later human civilizations in the old world. It's an insult to humanity to bring the xia dynasty into this comparison.
夏朝是一个虚构的、虚构的中国神话国家。二里头文化仅可追溯到商代早期。尽管C努力强行将其联系起来，但它与夏没有联系。苏美尔是一个经过考古证实的真实文明。它是旧世界后来所有人类文明的摇篮。把夏朝纳入这样的比较，是对人性的侮辱。
Dong-Yoon Lee
· Nov 29
It is not that two civilizations had no relation. Chinese learned Mesopotamian culture and began to remove all traces.
这并不是说两个文明没有关系。中国人学习了美索不达米亚文化，并开始消除所有痕迹。
Sourish Pradhan
· Nov 29
Just like they learnt culture from other neighbouring civilizations and removed all the traces.
就像他们从其他邻近文明那里学习文化并消除所有痕迹一样。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
Goodi Shang
· Dec 1
Archaeologists have found the xia Dynasty capital ruins and have been excavating and developing them for over 60 years. The museum is dozens of times larger than the Taj Mahal.
考古学家发现了夏朝都城遗址，并对其进行了60多年的发掘和开发。该博物馆比泰姬陵大几十倍。
Sourish Pradhan
· Dec 2
Erlitou culture has no connection to xia dynasty. 1750 - 1530 BCE falls closer to early shang period (1600 BCE). The “palace” that was found there dates to 1500 BCE. Well within early shang and nowhere near xia period.
Taj Mahal is a disgrace to India. Every non-Muslim Indian hates it. It holds no significance for ancient India. Ancient Buddhist, Hindu and Jain temples are more valuable for the country’s heritage.
二里头文化与夏朝没有任何联系。公元前 1750-1530 年更接近商代早期（公元前 1600年）。在那里发现的“宫殿”可以追溯到公元前 1500 年。远在商代早期，远不及夏代。
泰姬陵是印度的耻辱。每个非穆斯林印度人都讨厌它。它对古印度没有任何意义。古代佛教、印度教和耆那教寺庙对于该国的遗产来说更有价值。
Goodi Shang
· Dec 2
The facts are there, you can't argue.
事实摆在那里，你无法反驳。
Baw-Lin Liu
· Nov 29
xia was prehistoric and it could be a portion of Sumer. People probably had no intention to remove their heritage, but they could not trace back due to prehistoric situations.
夏是史前的，可能是苏美尔的一部分。人们可能无意消除他们的遗产，但由于史前情况而无法追溯。
Peter Kauffner
·
The xia dynasty is a legend, so this question is not posed correctly.
Perhaps what you are really asking for is a comparison between the Sumerian and the Chinese civilizations. Uruk, the city of Gilgamesh, was founded around 5000 BC. Erlitou in China was founded around 1750 BC.
Writing developed in Sumer about two thousand years before it developed in China. Sumerian writing originated around 3200 BC. Writing developed in Egypt and in the Indus valley at around the same time.
As for China, Shang oracle bone scxt goes back to 1300 BC.
夏朝是一个传说，所以这个问题提得不正确。
也许你真正想要的是苏美尔文明和中华文明之间的比较。乌鲁克，吉尔伽美什城，建于公元前 5000 年左右。中国的二里头始建于公元前1750年左右。
文字在苏美尔的发展比在中国的发展早了大约两千多年。苏美尔文字起源于公元前 3200 年左右。埃及和印度河谷大约同时发展了文字。
至于中国，商代甲骨文的历史可以追溯到公元前1300年。
CHANG YU
· Nov 29
Please stop your double standards
The OP has made it very clear that the earliest city in China is the ancient city of Chengtoushan, not the Erlitou site. It existed at about the same time as Uruk. This was ancient times and a mature country had not yet been formed.
The Erlitou site is much later and is considered the capital of the xia Dynasty, a dynasty in China with detailed historical records. Mature dynasties and empires have emerged in this era, and they even recorded the names of each king and what they encountered.
Just like you cannot regard the Ptolemaic Dynasty as the beginning of ancient Egypt, the xia Dynasty is not the beginning of Chinese civilization. The xia Dynasty was the same as the Ptolemaic Dynasty, but it was a later era with detailed documentary records.
请停止你的双重标准
答主已经介绍的很清楚，中国最早的城市是城头山古城，并不是二里头遗址，它存在于和乌鲁克城差不多的时代。这是远古时代，还没有形成成熟的国家。
二里头遗址要晚得多，它被认为是夏朝的首都，是中国有详细历史记录的王朝。这个时代已经出现了成熟的王朝和帝国，他们连每一位国王的名字和他们遇到的事情都记录了下来。
就像你不能把托勒密王朝作为古埃及的开始一样，夏朝也并不是中华文明的开始。夏朝和托勒密王朝一样，只是一个更晚的，拥有了详细文献记录的时代。