欧洲妹子来中国学习遭遇文化冲击：内衣到底能不能和其他衣服一起放在洗衣机洗？（上）
Is it actually unhygienic to wash underwear in the washing machine or just a cultural thing?
译文简介
两个月前，我来到中国求学，目前在大学里和一个来自缅甸（有中国家庭背景）的女孩住在一起。
正文翻译
Is it actually unhygienic to wash underwear in the washing machine or just a cultural thing?
用洗衣机洗内衣真的不卫生还是只是一种文化现象？
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We also share a bathroom, and my roommate bought a washing machine with her previous roommate, which we now share as well. (Background for the screenshots: They didn’t buy the washing machine that long ago, so when the roommate moved out spontaneously and I could move in the same day, I agreed to give her a part of what she paid for the washing machine bc it’s still cheaper than paying each time for the public washer and she was considering selling it…)
两个月前，我来到中国求学，目前在大学里和一个来自缅甸（有中国家庭背景）的女孩住在一起。我总共要在这里生活一年。我很幸运，当我到达这里时，还有一个房间可用，因为我搬进来的时间比较迟，所有其他房间都已经被占满了。
我们还共用一个卫生间，我的室友和她的前室友买了一台洗衣机，现在我们也共用一台。（截图的背景：这台洗衣机买的时间并不长，所以当前室友突然搬走，而我又在同一天搬进来时，我同意把支付一部分买洗衣机的钱来使用这台洗衣机，因为这比每次付公共洗衣机的钱还便宜，而且她正在考虑把洗衣机卖掉......）。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
第一次使用时，我把所有的衣服都放在一起洗，只按颜色分开，就像我在欧洲家里做的那样。当我把衣服挂起来时，她问我是否把内衣和其他衣服一起洗了，我说是，她感到非常震惊。然后就开始喋喋不休地说洗内裤很不卫生，而且这不符合“中国文化”。显然，她的内裤都是用手洗的。我告诉她我会考虑一下，然后就去网上搜索关于一起洗是否真的不卫生或者这只是一种文化的权威信息。我一无所获（所有的文章都只谈到如何保护内衣免受损坏......），所以如果有人有任何相关信息，请与我分享！
Because I didn’t find that much but didn’t want to start a bigger fight about something so minor, I then started kind of pre-washing my underwear by hand and throwing it in after it was already clean, so that at least I don’t have to spend even more time just washing out the hand wAsh Detergent. I already think that’s a lot of effort on my part just to appease her and wasn’t even sure if I’ll keep doing it, since the underwear is also clean if I just wash it regularly in the washing machine.
另外，如果用洗衣机洗内衣裤真的那么不卫生/肮脏，那她为什么可以用洗衣机洗袜子呢？我个人认为袜子更脏。我和她谈过这个问题，但她一直坚持说袜子可以，但内衣不行......
因为我没找到什么信息，但又不想因为这么小的事引起更大的争吵，所以我就开始用手预洗内衣裤，洗干净后再扔进去，这样至少我就不用花更多的时间去洗掉手洗的洗涤剂了。我已经觉得为了安抚她，我花了很多精力，甚至不确定我是否会继续这样做，因为如果我定期用洗衣机洗，内衣本来就是干净的。
I don’t really want to use the public washers, since it would cost me more money and also because it really is very convenient to just use the one in our bathroom so I don’t have to go all the way to the basement and back every time I do my laundry.
I don’t know how to answer her, I don’t really want to wash my underwear by hand only because it just takes more effort without any different result but I also don’t want to make her actually angry at me.
So I would appreciate mostly that you share if you have had a similar experience or any actual proof (scientific articles or from legit news sources etc) that washing the underwear with the rest of the laundry is good/bad. Though if you just want to share your opinion that’s fine as well.
然而，她随后给我发来了你在上面的截图中可以看到的信息。
我真的不想用公共洗衣机，因为那会花更多的钱，而且用我们浴室里的洗衣机真的很方便，这样我就不用每次洗衣服都跑到地下室再跑回来了。
我不知道该怎么回答她，我真的不想用手洗内衣裤，因为那样只会花更多的力气，却没有任何不同的效果，但我也不想让她真的生我的气。
所以，如果你有过类似的经历，或者有任何实际证据（科学文章或权威的新闻来源等）证明内衣裤和其他衣物一起洗是好的/坏的，我将非常感激你的分享。当然，如果你只是想分享你的观点，也是可以的。
Ok, so there are 3 types of Chinese people. Type A think underwear is too dirty to be washed with other clothes. Type B think other clothes are too dirty so they need to hand wash underwear separately. And Type C like me would put underwear in washer. These 3 types of Chinese fight perpetually online, we won’t change our mind for anything.
You can buy a portable tiny little washer to wash your underwear. It should be pretty cheap and wouldn’t take too much room.
好吧，中国人有3种类型。A 类人认为内衣太脏，不能和其他衣服一起洗。B 类人认为其他衣服太脏，所以需要单独手洗内衣。而 C 类人就像我一样，会把内衣放在洗衣机里洗。这三种类型的中国人在网上的争吵永无止息，我们不会因为任何事情改变自己的想法。
你可以买一个便携式的小洗衣机来洗内衣。它应该很便宜，而且不占地方。
Yeah, my wife refuses to put socks with other clothes, but she'll put underwear in with the main clothes load.
After 6 years of marriage, I just go with it. Doesn't really matter in the end.
是的，我妻子拒绝把袜子和其他衣服放在一起，但她会把内衣和主要衣服放在一起。
结婚6年了，我也就顺其自然了。说到底这其实并不重要。
My MIL refuses to hang socks to dry. They have to be laid flat, but can't go on the ground of other surfaces, so need to put some cardboard or something on the ground to dry them. I thought she was insane, until we got a new Ayi, 15 years younger and from a different end of the country than my MIL, and she insists exactly the same thing. Socks cannot be hung out to dry!
我的岳母拒绝把袜子挂起来晾干。它们必须平放，但又不能放在地面或其他表面上，所以需要在地面上放一些纸板或其他东西来晾干。我以为她疯了，直到我们请了一个新的阿姨，她比我的岳母年轻 15 岁，来自其他地方，结果她也坚持做同样的事情。袜子不能挂着晾干！
Whoever does the laundry gets to choose...
谁干活谁选择呗...
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
OP
That sounds actually funny, but yea it’s good to know that apparently even Chinese people don’t fully agree on it haha
“中国人有3种类型。”
这听起来很有趣，很高兴知道即使是中国人也不完全同意这一点哈哈
I haven't been able to use a kettle, especially a hotel kettle, since I learned that people wash their underpants in them.
自从我知道人们用热水壶洗内裤以来，我一直无法直视热水壶，尤其是酒店的热水壶。
原创翻译：龙腾网 https://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
Wtf that’s really nuts. Do they still use the kettle as regular kettle? D:
Can anyone share how dirty their undies are for it to be boiled in the kettle?
什么鬼，这真是太疯狂了。他们还像普通水壶一样使用这些水壶吗？D:
谁能分享一下他们的内裤有多脏才会放在水壶里煮？
I had the same, but on the different side. My roommate said that it was hardmful to ME. That if I wash my underwear in the washing machine then I'll get UTI's and stuff. She said the machine and other thigns arw dirty and you ahould take care of your private parts.
Well, I bought a small washing machine for 300 on taobao and only use it for ym underwear with detol and warm water.
She might not change her mind on it but maybe you can get a small machine for your undies yo make life easier and stop the unnecessary fights.
我也有过同样的经历，不过说辞不同。我的室友说这对我很不好。说如果我用洗衣机洗内裤，就会得尿道炎之类的病。她说洗衣机和其他东西都很脏，你应该爱护自己的私处。
好吧，我在淘宝上花了 300 块钱买了一个小洗衣机，只用它来洗内衣，用去污剂和温水。
你的室友可能不会改变主意，但也许你可以买个小洗衣机来洗内衣，这样生活会更轻松，也能避免不必要的争吵。
UTIs don't happen from washing underwear with clothes. They happen from holding urine in too long too often, not wiping front to back only, using bidés, poor hygiene, and from ecoli from the rectum transferring to the urethra if underwear isn't changed everyday or during sex.
将内衣与衣服一起清洗不会导致尿道炎。它们的发生是由于憋尿时间太长、经常憋尿、没有很好地擦拭、使用净身器、卫生条件差，以及如果每天或性交过程中没有更换内衣，直肠大肠杆菌会转移到尿道。
it's funny but ok, everyone with their own habits. The problem is way it's communicated and dealt with. You can notice a slightly aggressive tone and also diaconsiderate. Don't waste your time and energy on thia., Buy a small washer and that's it. If you escalate this it will turn into a thing like " if you don't like how we do it in China then go home!" :)). She obviously lacks people skills and flexibility in thinking.
这有点搞笑，但没关系，每个人都有自己的习惯。问题在于沟通和处理的方式。你可以注意到他们的语气略带咄咄逼人，但也不乏体贴。不要在这件事上浪费时间和精力，买个小洗衣机就好了。如果你把这件事升级，就会变成“如果你不喜欢我们在中国的做法，那就回家去！”这样的事情。:)) 她显然缺乏待人接物的技巧和思维的灵活性。
OP
Yea, she is my age but seems much more childish in general too (and I’ve met Chinese younger than her that seem more mature ). I’ll just do that then, because I have no interest whatsoever to actually start a bigger fight and I can totally see her coming up with that exact argument haha
是的，她和我同龄，但总的来说似乎更孩子气（我遇到过比她年轻的中国人，他们看起来更成熟）。那我就这么做吧，因为我根本没兴趣和她大吵一架，而且我完全可以预见她会提出这样的论点，哈哈
You stumbled upon one of the eternal discussion that plagues Chinese social media since the beginning of time. My wife (Chinese) puts everything in the washer and despises everyone who washes underwear by hand because she rightly believes that only water with at least 40 degrees can clean stuff.
你不经意间碰上了困扰中国社交媒体的经久不衰的话题之一。我的妻子（中国人）把所有东西都放进洗衣机，她鄙视所有用手洗内衣的人，因为她自认为只有 40 度以上的水才能洗干净东西。
Most Chinese washers don't have a warm of hot cycle
大多数中国洗衣机都没有热循环功能
It’s a stupid ass myth that my parent’s generation passed down to some of us. 99.9% of the bacteria won’t survive laundry detergent, and the 0.1% that does, will still do if you’re handwashing; in fact the sinks that most people wash their underwear in probably have a higher bacteria count than the washing machine (unless you have a moldy washing machine, in that case you probably should deep clean it before you wash anything in it.)
I’d argue that the most unhygienic process in the “Chinese way” of laundry is the drying. If you hand washed something, there’s no way you can wring it out as well as the spin-drying in the machine, so the wet clothes just sit there, a perfect place for bacteria and mold to grow.
If people wanna hand wash their shit, by all means; but don’t fuck with my way of doing things and god forbid not let me use the SHARED washing machine.
这是我们父辈传给我们的一个愚蠢的神话。99.9% 的细菌都无法在洗衣粉中存活，而那 0.1% 的细菌，如果你用手洗的话，还是可以存活的；事实上，大多数人洗内衣的水槽里的细菌数量可能比洗衣机里的细菌数量还要高（除非你的洗衣机发霉了，如果是这样的话，你可能应该在用洗衣机洗东西之前对它进行深度清洁）。
我认为，“中国式”洗衣中最不卫生的程序是晾干。如果你手洗了东西，就不可能像在洗衣机里脱水那样拧干，所以湿衣服就只能放在那里，成为细菌和霉菌生长的绝佳场所。
如果人们想手洗他们的东西，可以，但不要来妨碍我的做事方式，更不要让我使用共用的洗衣机。
What drives me really bonkers is how particular Chinese people are in general about cleanliness, I can dig that though, it took me a while to come around and I have, yet the absolute poop they will eat and where it was prepared? Like, you can’t have dirty clothes or underwear or apartment floors but eating food that’s been prepared in a kitchen that hasn’t been cleaned in a week in a pokey little restaurant is fine?!??! Like, IT’S GOING INSIDE YOU!!!
最让我抓狂的是，中国人一般对清洁卫生都很挑剔，这一点我可以理解，但我花了好长时间都无法理解的是他们是怎么能接受在一些场景里制作的垃圾食品的？就像，你不能有脏衣服、脏内裤、脏地板，但吃一个小餐馆里一个星期都没打扫过的厨房里做出来的食物就没问题？它可是要进入你的身体的啊！！！！
That was my first impression reading this.
Seating street food prepared by some guy picking his nose is fine, but no underwear in the washer?
这是我读到这个帖子的第一印象。
由某个挖着鼻孔的家伙准备的街头小吃是可以的，但洗衣机就是不能放内衣？
A lot of that got absorbed into Western culture too, we've just accepted it for hundreds of years so we don't question it.
European sailors wrestled with all sorts of diseases including dysentery. Chinese fishermen didn't.
Chinese drank tea.
Western captain notices this and replaces drinking water on ships with cooled tea. Dysentery drops considerably. Tea must have healing powers!
Nothing to do with the fact that they boiled the water to make the tea.
“愚蠢的神话”
很多东西也被西方文化所吸收，我们只是接受了上百年了，所以不会产生质疑。
欧洲水手曾经与包括痢疾在内的各种疾病搏斗。中国渔民却没有。
中国人喝茶。
西方船长注意到了这一点，于是在船上用冷却的茶水代替了饮用水。痢疾的发病率大大降低。茶一定有治病的功效！
这与他们是不是用热水泡的茶无关。
It’s actually true though. Underwear and socks have more germs, there has been research on this. It’s also true washers don’t kill germs. They used to, but we now use low water ones that also wash at lower temp. We also don’t use germ killing soap general. The consensus is washing with detergent does very little to kill gets and there is actually a fair bit of cross contamination. The step that does kill germs is drying. If you dry to completion that kills most germs. Also, as long as you run your washers clean cycle every few weeks to kill built up bacteria and add a dash of color safe bleach to the wash, it then will kill germs.
I know this… because i had to argue with my wife about this. I 100% want to wash and dry my clothes in the machine. Hand washing sucks. But i did do my research. And found the other side actually has a very fair point to make. It’s simply only true if you are lazy about it. Use color safe bleach and you are fine. And don’t forget to clean your washer regularly.
As a last note, the air drying is actually the best way to kill bacteria. But this is only true if it’s in direct sunlight. UV radiation is the most effective germ killer. This doesn’t really apply if you are air trying inside a city in a laundry room with little to no sun though.
但事实确实如此。内衣和袜子上的细菌更多，对此已有研究。洗衣机杀不死细菌也是事实。以前可以，但我们现在用的是低水量、低温度的洗衣机。我们一般也不使用杀菌肥皂。大家的共识是，用洗涤剂清洗对杀菌的作用很小，而且实际上会造成一定程度的交叉感染。能杀死细菌的步骤是烘干。如果烘干完成，就能杀死大部分细菌。此外，只要你每隔几周使用洗衣机的清洁循环来杀死积聚的细菌，并在洗涤时加入少许安全漂白剂，就能杀死细菌。
我之所以知道这一点......是因为我不得不和我妻子争论这个问题。我 100%想用洗衣机洗衣服和晾衣服。手洗太糟糕了。但我还是做了调查。发现对方的观点其实很有道理。只有当你懒得去做的时候，这才是真的。使用安全的漂白剂。别忘了定期清洗你的洗衣机。
最后一点，风干其实是杀死细菌的最好方法。但这只有在阳光直射的情况下才是正确的。紫外线辐射是最有效的杀菌剂。不过，如果你是在城市里几乎没有阳光的洗衣房内晾晒，这一点就不太适用了。
There’s no way bacteria survive a full wash cycle with soap. Whether it kills them or not, they certainly must get washed away in the several rinse cycles. I would also be willing to bet that a proper dryer does as good a job at killing any bacteria as UV light does.
细菌不可能在肥皂的完整洗涤周期中存活下来。无论是否杀死它们，它们肯定会在几个漂洗周期中被冲走。我也愿意打赌，合适的烘干机在杀死细菌方面与紫外线一样好。
Start making up some of your own rules.
Dairy products and fruit can't both be in the refrigerator - they'll cross contaminate! Wipe your forearms down with wet wipes on entering the house.
开始制定一些你自己的规则。
奶制品和水果不能同时放在冰箱里--它们会交叉感染！进门时用湿纸巾擦拭前臂。
It’s a actually a cultural thing not rules she randomly made up. I don’t think she’s trying to be difficult but just finds it really abhorrent and unhygienic. People seem so keen to follow all of Japan’s rules and etiquette like taking off shoes and a million other things but get angry at this. Feel free to let her know what you find unacceptable but no need to be a dick on purpose. It’s literally the culture.
这其实是一种文化，而不是她随意编造的规则。我觉得她并不是故意刁难，只是觉得这真的很令人厌恶而且不卫生。人们似乎很热衷于遵守日本的所有规则和礼仪，比如脱鞋和其他许多事情，但却对这一点很生气。你可以让她知道你不能接受什么，但没必要故意表现得像个混蛋。从字面上看，这就是一种文化。
Chinese people have this odd life where they younger generation (let’s say 40 and below) grew up with massive technological advancements, being used to having the convenience of laundry machines whereas their parents were virtually still washing clothes by the river. This means that they sometimes get a (well intentioned but faulty) brainwashing from the older generations that they really have to do certain things that just aren’t relevant anymore, like ALWAYS KEEPING THE DAMN WINDOWS OPEN NO MATTER HOW FUCKING COLD IT GETS AT Chinese NEW YEAR because the oldies are still thinking of those old stoves they used that had a pretty high chance of poisoning the air, even if they are using electricity and modern gas installations nowadays. Same goes for underwear: if you have a washing machine that can go to 60 C+ it’s fine because it kills bacteria. A lower temperature is indeed less sanitary. You probably won’t want to wash your towels with the underwear of someone with chlamydia at 30 degrees or something.
中国人的生活很奇怪，他们的年轻一代（比如说40岁及以下）是在巨大的技术进步中长大的，习惯了洗衣机的便利，而他们的父母实际上仍在河边洗衣服。这就意味着，他们有时会受到老一辈人的洗脑（用心良苦，但却是错误的），认为他们真的必须做某些已经不再适用的事情，比如无论春节期间天气有多冷，都要把该死的窗户打开，因为老一辈人还在想着他们曾经使用的会产生有害气体那些老式炉灶，即使他们现在已经用上了电和现代化的燃气设备。内衣也是如此：如果你有一台能洗到 60 摄氏度以上的洗衣机，那就没问题，因为它能杀死细菌。较低的温度确实不太卫生。你可能不想在 30 度或其他温度下将毛巾与衣原体感染者的内衣一起清洗。
You still see a lot of people washing their clothes in the river in poorer towns and rural areas. The river in wulingyuan when I visited zhangjiajie would have locals hand washing their household laundry in the river every day, they didn't look like really poor people either, seemed more like tradition than necessity. Wasting 2+ hours a week hand washing clothes when going to a laundromat is cheap seems bizarre to me.
在较贫困的城镇和农村地区，你仍然可以看到很多人在河里洗衣服。我去张家界的时候，武陵源的河里每天都会有当地人在河里手洗家里的衣服，他们看起来也不像是真正的穷人，似乎更像是传统而非必需品。在我看来，如果去洗衣店洗衣服很便宜，那么每周浪费 2 个多小时手洗衣服就很奇怪了。